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18 August 2012 04:42 |
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| MattButlerPhoto Photographer | I get wound up on behalf of mua's. Seems an even more under valued skill than being a tog. A top mua's can make such a difference to a shoot |
 | 18 August 2012 05:07 |
| HowardJ Photographer  Location United Kingdom Surrey | I think it depends on the situation: Some MUAs saying they won't do wedding make-up on a TF basis. I'm sure there are some new MUAs or someone doing training that would jump at the chance. Sure there's a risk they may not be any good, but you're getting them for free. It may be they want to learn how to work under pressure or learning better organisational skills or learning to work with customers or learning what happens on a wedding day or networking with a wedding photographer/planner. They may do it once and discover there's not much to learn. It depends on the situation. Some Photographers saying they won't work for free. I'm sure if there was the right opportunity for a new photographer to get practice or get access to a particular location or work as an assistant to an established photographer or the opportunity to get an insight into a particular area of business then they'd work for free. It depends on the situation. These same photographers who won't work for free believe that models should do TF for a year as they need to 'train'. Some Models saying they won't do TF to 'train' when some photographers think all models need to do a 'training' period where they get to shoot them for free. Some models don't need to 'train', so why should they do TF for year for free when they could be making money? Just because some photographers tell them it's 'required'? There's always going to be a case for someone to work for free or at a reduced rate to learn a new skill or gain something of value to them and there's always going to be people who don't need to work for free because they're at a higher level of experience before they decide to start doing it as a career/hobby. However there will always be situations where I feel someone should always be PAID e.g. topless work, adult work modelling work. Some people won't like other people working for free/charging. Everyone is different and it depends what they're gaining from the job. Is it a good thing for a person to be working for a long period for free? Probably not. |
| 18 August 2012 05:44 |
| profilepictures Photographer  Location United Kingdom Suffolk Bury St Edmunds | For the record, Simplydevine exluded from any negative impressions, beautiful work, you should say 'hi' more often.  |
| 18 August 2012 05:58 |
| HowardJ Photographer Location United Kingdom Surrey |  Quote from profilepicturesFor the record, Simplydevine exluded from any negative impressions, beautiful work, you should say 'hi' more often. Very cool.. |
18 August 2012 09:01 |
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| jessewalker Make-up Artist | Quote from Secondskin My first post in months....as Simply Divine points out...I dont even bother with this site anymore, but a link from facebook brings me here today to stick my nose into this post...lol...... AndromedaX is FABULOUS at doing her own make up!!!! I look at her work and wish it was mine..lol. I do like to think that I dont just slap some make up on some faces...haha...I kinda hope that a lot of my work is worth what I charge. Although, I dont get to showcase it on here anymore as I wont pay the subscription because of the ridiculous TF abuse on here!! I cant remember the last time I got paid work from Purestorm so I decided....dont get stressed...just promote myself elsewhere ..Thankfully the photographic studios, film studios and fire service that I have contracts with think im worthy...lol. And as for the wedding tf????? Hey, Il do it....Il take along my special fx kit ...how dya fancy a nice aged look, or maybe the living dead???? haha, how tempted am I to apply just for the look on her face when she realises iv turned her into chuckies bride..karma for her sheer cheek!! .lol Haha lol gonna get my nose and scar wax & bloody gloopy blood out for the beautiful TF bride. On another note, just got home from doing a wedding just now... What a beautiful day to get married! |
| 18 August 2012 10:54 |
| jdphoto Photographer  Location United Kingdom Bedfordshire Flitwick | Quote from jessewalker You can practice on friends/family. Doing weddings a strong source of income for many make-up artists, I just find it insulting! as do we photographers  |
| 18 August 2012 13:28 |
| Marty_W Photographer  Location United Kingdom Suffolk | oh my, there are lots of swearing smiley faces on here tonight  If this site is here to help everyone out why not do this. Why not have photographers and models help out the mua? Why not get toggs/photographers (whatever you wanna be called) get a stunning mod/model (whatever you wanna be called) and get the photographer to do the make-up? It'll show how important MUA are.....and it'll be amusing. Just a thought |
19 August 2012 12:21 |
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| Secondskin Make-up Artist This member has been reset to pending | Quote from HowardJ I think it depends on the situation: Some MUAs saying they won't do wedding make-up on a TF basis. I'm sure there are some new MUAs or someone doing training that would jump at the chance. Sure there's a risk they may not be any good, but you're getting them for free. It may be they want to learn how to work under pressure or learning better organisational skills or learning to work with customers or learning what happens on a wedding day or networking with a wedding photographer/planner. They may do it once and discover there's not much to learn. It depends on the situation. Some Photographers saying they won't work for free. I'm sure if there was the right opportunity for a new photographer to get practice or get access to a particular location or work as an assistant to an established photographer or the opportunity to get an insight into a particular area of business then they'd work for free. It depends on the situation. These same photographers who won't work for free believe that models should do TF for a year as they need to 'train'. Some Models saying they won't do TF to 'train' when some photographers think all models need to do a 'training' period where they get to shoot them for free. Some models don't need to 'train', so why should they do TF for year for free when they could be making money? Just because some photographers tell them it's 'required'? There's always going to be a case for someone to work for free or at a reduced rate to learn a new skill or gain something of value to them and there's always going to be people who don't need to work for free because they're at a higher level of experience before they decide to start doing it as a career/hobby. However there will always be situations where I feel someone should always be PAID e.g. topless work, adult work modelling work. Some people won't like other people working for free/charging. Everyone is different and it depends what they're gaining from the job. Is it a good thing for a person to be working for a long period for free? Probably not. Hey Howard..No one is saying that there isnt a place for TF?? there absolutely is...that is not the point that was raised here. The point is...we Muas are sick and tired of being taken for mugs!!! ridiculous requests. There is a current request on the castings list at the moment... a pregnant model asking for someone to cast her bump for free? Being a special fx artist I know the cost of materials and the work involved...so ok, putting the cost aside if youre not bothered about losing the money....what exactly is in it for the Mua?? She wants to keep the casting...there is no mention of a photographer or shoot and lets face it...what would you shoot? So I decided to bite the bullet and email her and ask her if I were to do this what do I get in return (as TF is meant to be mutually beneficial??????) Her answer?????....PRACTICE!! Now forgive me, I may have lost the plot somewhere...but If I was pregnant ...would I want to someone who needed practice casting my precious bump?? It CAN be dangerous....I think not!!! Feeble answer for someone who is simply being cheeky....asking for something for nothing!! Not even having the manners to offer to pay for materials??? So alright love, il come and do the work, pay for the materials and you go home with your lovely cast...hmmmm What a wonderfully fair collaboration.....THIS is what we Muas are making a fuss about!! |
19 August 2012 12:33 |
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| Secondskin Make-up Artist This member has been reset to pending | Oops Im tired...so sorry for the typos!   |
19 August 2012 12:35 |
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| Secondskin Make-up Artist This member has been reset to pending | Quote from Marty_W oh my, there are lots of swearing smiley faces on here tonight If this site is here to help everyone out why not do this. Why not have photographers and models help out the mua? Why not get toggs/photographers (whatever you wanna be called) get a stunning mod/model (whatever you wanna be called) and get the photographer to do the make-up? It'll show how important MUA are.....and it'll be amusing. Just a thought Well said!!! I fully appreciate a photographers work and NEVER ask for something for nothing...... I fully appreciate that a models work is much harder than what people think and will pay for a good pro model...... So......Why shouldnt I expect to be appreciated ??? simples!!! Although, I do have to mention in relation to your post....I do know some models AND photographers who are actually quite talented in make up. So its more a case of being appreciated for your talent not your title :-) |
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