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OK...what has gone wrong?

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Anthonygh is off-lineSilver Member
29 January 2016 19:21
anthonyh
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
Kent


Moved my paying account to Purpleport......it is where the models are and it is where the site owners seem concerned about developing the site...sort of the opposite of this site. What has gone wrong?...PS is definitely far behing PP as a models site..and please...no rose coloured glasses responses!


AGS is off-line
30 January 2016 00:20
AndyGStudios
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
West Yorkshire
Wakefield

Empires rise and fall... personally I neither use nor like PP, one step in the wrong direction and you get a jackboot up the bottom from some cowardly anonymous admin, regardless of your paying or free status... true dat, ask around. So imho it's nice here. I'm also on MM. I mostly shoot paid now rather than pay models, though happy to occasionally update a port tf from time to time. Did a babysmash yesterday, got a christening tomorrow... and a new hair model monday, it's all go. Couldnt give a rats about pp to be frank, so the pace here suits me just fine. I don't shoot for the sake of shooting anymore, no need.

Also, since models are getting paid AND getting images now, TF is losing it's meaning and usefulness; it's focus seems to be shifting to personal things like weddings and family shoots; so if you don't have a good number of zero's in the bank, and/or a pacemaker in the chest, just don't login very often.

Loads of sites are quiet, not just PS, which I agree is a shadow of it's former self. Sign of the times imho. Rinsers, Stripper rates, GWC's and Amazon wishlists. There if ya want it, still there if ya don't. Lots of people are here for the wrong reasons I think, and they make it toxic for those who 'are' here for the right reasons. But the green crinkly rent money will win every time, people would be daft not to try their luck.


Steven Jardine is off-linePlatinum Member
30 January 2016 03:07
RedChecker
Photographer
RedChecker
Location
United Kingdom
Buckinghamshire
Stoke Mandeville

While this site has its problems, it performs the basic function we need.

The big problem for PP is that the owner, and his 'inner circle' are running the place like their own personal social club without a hint of impartiality. Upset any one of them and they won't hesitate to ban you without explanation. You'll also often find posts deleted/blocked if they don't like what you're saying (and likely given an unexplained ban too). They also don't like banter unless it's from one of their own either, and they allow their inner circle to swear like troopers whereas anyone else will get an instant ban... it's like treading on eggshells on there.

The site is also geared up for a very small group of 'elite' (the inner circle) to gain unfair advantage / exposure through things like PPI etc. (no matter how bad/mundane an image is from one of them, they will always get their images on the front page, not to mention little tricks for pushing their castings to the top of the list) which doesn't make it a level playing field for others who pay for the site.

For all its failings and lack of bells/whistles, the impartiality of Purestorm and its owner IMO goes a long way.
I prefer not to think before I speak. I like being just as surprised as everyone else by what comes out of my mouth.


Pentti Pohjonen is off-lineSilver Member
30 January 2016 03:31
PHP_Photography
Photographer
PHP_Photography
Location
Europe
Finland
VAASA

Quote from anthonyh
PS is definitely far behing PP as a models site..and please...no rose coloured glasses responses!


Other opinions are available.




Bob is off-linePlatinum Member
30 January 2016 05:50
Bob
Photographer
Bob
Location
United Kingdom
Devon
Honiton

Quote from AndyGStudios
Loads of sites are quiet, not just PS, which I agree is a shadow of it's former self. Sign of the times imho.



Yep. Compared with a decade ago, or even with the start of this decade, the whole scene has died.

Blow away the smoke, crack the mirrors to see what is behind and ignore the bells and flashing lights on the site which currently has the highest profile and you will find that with the exception of its, at times heavily censored to present a false impression, mainstream forums it is actually lot quieter than many people realise.

Having been active on many of the UK sites, plus MM which has a high UK membership, for over twelve years I reckon the heyday for this type of site was around 2009 and since 2012 the whole scene has been on the slide; though admittedly one new site geared towards milking hobbyist photographers for the benefit of a comparatively small number of nude models did cause a temporary blip a couple of years back.

Model/Photographer sites are no different from social networking sites or, for that matter, even supermarket chains in that one will rise to prominence and then drop off as many customers shift their allegiance to a competitor that appears to be on the rise. Where our little part of the world differs, however, is that:
  • the Lads Mags scene that encouraged many young women to take up modelling 5-15 years ago has died
  • the smartphone has taken over from the computer and
  • in this internet era where the  image is now regarded by many as something of little worth, few models now seem all that interested in creating images for the sake of creating images (though many are willing to pose for camera users with fat wallets irrespective of the standard or quality of the resultant snaps).

This place was great at its zenith - just like Net-Model, Web-Models, AllModelZone and ModelMayhem were - but, like all good things, it one day must come to an end. The only thing that puzzles me is why Matt & Tim still keep it going, though as both always used to say they had not created this site to make money maybe that is the answer.

As this site has served me well I'll probably hang in right to the end... just like I'm doing on Net-Model.

Bob


Frank Sinnott is off-line
30 January 2016 08:33
frankpht
Photographer
frankpht
Location
United Kingdom
London


Well PP it would seem is king of the hill but it's so sweet it makes me sick. I was suspended once and told I was mainly making the Admins life harder than they wanted. I would regard myself as being a "nice guy" and try to keep everyone happy but sometimes it just can't be done. General rule on PP is be nice to everyone even if you have to talk through your a**e.

I've little success in getting TFP shots there but have none here anymore. MM is still my main source of TF models but as already been said TFP is a dying thing and cash is king.


marlham is off-line
30 January 2016 09:10
marlhamphoto
Photographer
This member has been reset to pending
marlhamphoto
Location
United Kingdom
Kent
Canterbury

I don't like PP or the people who run it, mostly because I have principles. PP could be the best modelling site on the planet for all I care.

As for the 'inner circle' it pays to know who they are and avoid working with any of the models within it - unless you fancy a visit from someone you'd rather not share the same air with.


marlham is off-line
30 January 2016 09:12
marlhamphoto
Photographer
This member has been reset to pending
marlhamphoto
Location
United Kingdom
Kent
Canterbury

Quote from AndyGStudiosLots of people are here for the wrong reasons I think, and they make it toxic for those who 'are' here for the right reasons.


Yup.



marlham is off-line
30 January 2016 09:17
marlhamphoto
Photographer
This member has been reset to pending
marlhamphoto
Location
United Kingdom
Kent
Canterbury

Quote from Bob
...though admittedly one new site geared towards milking hobbyist photographers for the benefit of a comparatively small number of nude models did cause a temporary blip a couple of years back


Web-Models?
I never had much to do with it but it's the only site I can think of which might be the one you're referring to.


AGS is off-line
30 January 2016 09:24
AndyGStudios
Photographer

Location
United Kingdom
West Yorkshire
Wakefield

Quote from frankpht
Well PP it would seem is king of the hill


I'm really glad someone said "seem"- because that's all it is, a Bullingdon Club for the lads, squeezing out the last drips from a dying pastime. Be an admin, sleep with models... be in the cool club, get nailed - take that how you wish, it's ambiguous for a reason.

People don't understand the difference between a DSLR and a Smartphone... it's a camera, it takes pics - The End. A lot of the early 'pics' were sent to Chris at Beanprint (who used to run Web-Models), the resolution is so low that enlarged to A3/A2 they blur to crap. Looks good on the phone though, which is all they care about, it should look like that when printed. The number of people returning prints as "not fit for purpose" lead to Chris stopping printing photos in general, which is a shame, because I ran all my photos through him, and the quality was very, very, high. Every joe and his dog has a camera now, because they bought a phone. That imho is part of the reason for the decline.

Back in the day the playfield was quite even, models now tend to split into 2 groups... Experienced and worth it but charge very high rates... and newbies, many of whom are not suitable but heard there was money in it, or at the least they could get favours from photographers and get them to work for free. Which is great, except, it deprives a working photographer from earning towards a living with their skill. This I believe is why it's expected that today all photographers will work for free, regardless.

Commercial TF imho is another nail in the coffin, in part perpetuated my models who go to fashion shops, offer to model for them (wigs, tops, sports gear etc), and when the question comes up how much a photographer will be - the answer is "don't worry, i'll get you a good deal")... the photographer then works for free, the model keeps the clothes, and the shop uses the images they haven't had to pay for to get done. And the idiot photographer paid for the studio because he was taken in by the charms of the lass, or extras maybe in the mix somewhere. One business talks to another, and before long you have this notion of 'commercial tf'. Great exposure... allegedly.

For TF weddings, have you 'SEEN' some of the returning images ? more than one photographer has been sued over this - not that they know to buy insurance that covers them, or they would charge. That chase to the bottom started with photographers seeing models getting married and wanting it "cheap as chips"... so £250 or bust.

Lastly, photographers are put off by people not knowing their rights under law for images, CDPA etc... so they get the images, stuff then through instagram, edit them in all sorts of ways, and if you mumble a hint of "I disapprove" you're blocked and branded a twat. Many models believe the photos are even 'THEIR' copyright, and go on to sell them etc. The more this happens, the more photographers go do something else. Ok, some don't care, but a lot do, because what the model does to the images, reflects on then photographer too.

So in a nutshell... Greed, Technology, and Taking the micky bigtime has contributed to the scene's downfall. How many of you find that businesses who want your image BADLY for their product, are surprised that you want paying ? Many chose to steel the images, and well, screw you... it used to be that was an easy one to tackle, but now, not so much. It must be said, heavy pocketed pornographers, and paying commercial entities are about all thats left. And many people just dare to dream, and, when nothing happens for them, they just walk away and leave a dead profile, or one that's not been active in 3 years, loads around.

Models know how to charge... you know this. But a charging photographer, OMG NEVER ! - Models Want the shoot and Want the images for their port. If they don't get it they trade on selfies rather than get good images done either on Tf, or choosing to pay a high quality, experienced photographer (yes folks it does work both ways.) There's no interest in investing in 'self' - so you have this situation of money flowing in one direction only, and hey why not, works for escorts and sexworkers, why not models. There was bound to be a meltdown sooner or later, and imho this is it. Enjoy lol It imploded... said it would, bout ohhhh 5 years ago... nobody listened.

But unless you pay for everything, even on TF, own a studio, are willing to pay stipper rates, or regularly pay lip service to the current king cool club - you're about sh!t out of luck these days.

Life lol...

Dunno bout the rest of you, but i'm as happy doing landscapes and cars



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